FS 17 - Raised Sheer

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Fuzz
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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by Fuzz » Mon Jan 02, 2017 1:24 pm

I have only used the Gel-magic to glue the side upper panels to the lower panels. I did not know you could use it for the main hull glue up. If Topwater says he used it to glue up his boat then we know it works just fine :D I was thinking more about the cure time. I know fast hardner and wood flower will set up in 8-10 hours at 50-60F.



joe2700
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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by joe2700 » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:24 pm

topwater wrote:I used Gel magic to glue all the panels on my boat, just tape the underside of the seams first .
Thanks topwater, you mean tape like painters tape to prevent drips not fiberglass tape right? I didn't tape under but the gel magic managed to stay in place.
remedy32 wrote:This looks real good so far. My advice is to take it a bit slow at this point. Check for fairness of the bottom as it transitions from "V" to near flat from bow to stern. Fiddling a bit now with tight or loose stitches can help fairness and vastly reduce the time and material required to fair the bottom before finishing. It also pays to take a look inside and see how the panels lay down against the molds. This can serve as a good indication of the finished shape you'll create. Also remember to pull the tip of the bow (facing down right now) back tightly against the bow mold. This will have a big effect on reducing the dreaded bow droop. Finally, I had no trouble with the spot welds letting go during the rounding. Like you I went beneath where accessible and made a small fillet but this was probable a bit of overkill. Really no need for big globs that will need to be sanded off later. Keep up the nice work.
Thanks Bill, I was happy withe the bottom being flat in the back half, only problem was that it fell off 1/4" or so the last 6" to the transom. Trying to fix that pulled the panels out of flat so I'm living with it. Like you suggest I went under the boat and made sure the panels were flat against the molds and stringers. The only gap was at b, and a brick right on top of the mold each side took care of it.

Based on what you say I'm glad I went back and put a v on the bow mold so I could pull the panels completely together. I think the profile looks ok, hard to tell upside down. Since I wan't be installing the extra side panels until the boat is upright I have a chance to play with the shape slightly if needed. I with I could have pondered and tweaked for a day or two before committing but I only have so many weekends I can go work on the boat so I had to get on with it.

My "big globs" should still be smaller than the fillet radius on the inside so shouldn't need to sand them, just a big more than putting glue only between the sheets. Kind of a mini fillet like you.
Fuzz wrote:I have only used the Gel-magic to glue the side upper panels to the lower panels. I did not know you could use it for the main hull glue up. If Topwater says he used it to glue up his boat then we know it works just fine :D I was thinking more about the cure time. I know fast hardner and wood flower will set up in 8-10 hours at 50-60F.
Thanks Fuzz, Jeff and I are working on my gel magic cure time right and he is great to work with as always, we'll get it figured out no problem. If I had figured out that mine takes so long before glueing up I would have used the ez fillet just for cure time, but aside from that point gel magic seems to work well, and those empty caulk tubes they stock here worked great for applying it. I'm not sure if ez fillet is too thick for using those or not.

For putting the 1/2" radius on before taping the outside has anyone started with a 1/2" radius bit our a router or anything, or are people just sanding and eyeballing it?
Last edited by joe2700 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jeff
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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by Jeff » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:37 pm

Joe, call me when you have time: 772.770.1225 Jeff

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topwater
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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by topwater » Tue Jan 03, 2017 8:24 am

Joe when i suggested tape on the back side i meant duct tape or packing tape . Just depends on how big of a gap there
was. I don't think you really need a 1/2" round over for your seams , closer to 3/8" worked well for me. I just used
a ro sander and my mark one eyeball to gage it.
Novi 23 finally launched !

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by joe2700 » Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:29 pm

With Jeff and Reid's investigatory work we finally figured out my Gel Magic problem. System 3 only advertises one hardener, which is the fast equivalent. That's what I ordered from these guys and what they ordered from System 3. They do however still make the slow hardener, which takes 16 hours at 77 degrees to become tack free instead of 3 hours. It's a special order only thing. System 3 had mistakenly mixed a few of those in with boat builder central's order, and I just happened to get those ones when I ordered from them.

It was a pretty confusing situation since the containers look the same, but after Reid got the barcodes from me, they were able to sort out what happened with system 3.

I have some much faster gel magic on it's way from system 3 now, so by the next time I can work on the boat things will cure up nice and quick. I won't have to burn so much propane heating the garage like a sauna in the middle of winter either(although that was nice sometimes). I did like applying the gel magic, very easy with the caulking gun, and it is just thick enough to stay in place upside down or vertically. Fills medium-large gaps pretty well.

One nice thing about working in winter is I can apply the products at 50 degrees or so if I need more working time, then crank the temp up to around 80 as soon as I'm done to shorten the cure time. I didn't need to do the first part with the gel magic I had so far haha.

Thanks to Jeff and Reid for working with me to figure out what was going on, it was a pretty random thing and not a mistake on their part at all. If I messed up any part of what went happened please correct me Jeff.

I'll be traveling for a bit so it will be a few weeks or a month until I can get to the boat again. It's sitting in the garage all stitched and glued right now. When I come back I'll take a good long look at everything again to make sure I'm happy with the shape then get her seams all taped up. I'd like to get the bottom glassed quickly so I can move it outside when I'm not working on it, my Mom is down her garage spot until then.

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by Jeff » Wed Jan 04, 2017 3:24 pm

Perfect summary!! Safe travels Joe2700!! Jeff

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by joe2700 » Sat Jan 28, 2017 3:00 pm

Back to work finally. Today I'll take a real good look over the shape of the hull to make sure I'm happy. I already plan to pop the aft 12 inches of the bottom off and raise it a 1/4" as thats the only low spot I remember. Once I'm completely happy with the shape I'll get to sanding the radius on the corners and cutting out tape and cloth for glassing the bottom tomorrow.

My new gel magic was here waiting for me, thanks to the boat builder central crew for working that all out for me. Has anyone noticed smoke from unmixed gel magic hardener? Mine has been smoking lightly since I opened it 30 minutes ago but I can't detect any heat being generated. It's a bit odd and I'll be keeping my eye on it for a while. Just mixed up a test batch though to confirm the normal cure time.

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by Jeff » Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:32 am

Joe2700, how did the test batch of the GelMagic do for you? Jeff

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by joe2700 » Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:46 am

Cured up right as expected Jeff, and the hardener even stopped smoking eventually haha. The gel magic situation is resolved!

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Re: FS 17 - Raised Sheer

Post by Jeff » Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:33 pm

Good Joe!! Glad this situation is fixed and I have learned that there is a "Slow" GelMagic but it has to be ordered as a special item from System Three!!! Jeff

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