Teak

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FLYonWALL9
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Re: Teak

Post by FLYonWALL9 » Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:05 am

I have worked with LOTS of hard wood not just on my last boat
but building furniture, and other projects and from what I see
in your picture and based on the thickness I wouldn't laminate
it. Also, using the dust in epoxy to make glues without a doubt
it will be darker than the stock its taken from. You can add a
clear filler along with it to match your color much better like
milled fiber. Make test batches and keep notes on measure-
ments until you come up with the proper color. But using the
dust alone will yield a much darker end result.

As for making the thick piece go to HomeDeposit and buy
yourself some "clear pine" cut it exactly like your current
stock, thickness, length, so forth. On the underside or side
that will be glued to the boat make kerf cuts say half way
through your stock (clear pine). Let me back up a bit, I
would make my first test cut at say 1/4" x the length of
the stock. If it doesn't bend easily adjust your cut until
it will make the curve easy. I would set up a jig like in
the link so that you can get the cuts to be as uniform as
possible. You can use a chop saw or table saw but IMHO
the thin blade of a hand saw would be much better and
easier to hide how it was done. Granted the clear pine it
will not bend the same but it will give you an idea of how
far apart and depth the kerf's need to be.

Once you have your test piece done it should bend easy
enough to push down on each end to conform to your
shape. I would then tape up the bow to catch epoxy
seepage :oops: (I prolly shouldn't use this word). Make up some
glue using the dust from your kerf's (this will show you how
different the dust is once wet) and add only a drop or two
in each kerf. Clamp or glue the board in place, don't forget
to use LOTS of tape, the epoxy wont stick to it as badly.

When you feel comfortable move onto your teak, again
start with shallow kerf's working your way up until the
stock conforms. Its not a bad faux pas to use screws
if you cant clamp it with enough pressure to hold while
the glue cures. Just get a plug cutter, counter sink your
screws and make plugs from the same stock you used
from scrap. Be sure to line up the grain in the plug so
it will be easier to hide.

Doing it this way should make it much more eye
appealing than long laminates.

FORGIVE ME IF SOMEONE ELSE has already suggested
making kerf to solve the problem.

Good luck and do post how it works out. Please send me
an email via the board so I can watch the project. I need
some motivation to get me back into boat building.

Cheers and have a blessed weekend.
Scott/FLY

SORRY if this post is excessively long :D



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ks8
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Re: Teak

Post by ks8 » Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:54 pm

... SORRY if this post is excessively long :D
Long? Now that's funny! :lol:

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cape man
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Re: Teak

Post by cape man » Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:58 am

Couple of comments...

Like Larry said, just go for it first. You might be pleasantly surprised with what a piece of wood can do. Don't break it, but see what it will do. I used 3/4" poplar on my gunwales and while it fought back, it made the curves along the bow. Not teak, and my curve was probably less than yours, but give it a shot.

Also, done well you should not see the kerf cuts and they should let you make that bend. As Scott said, make them as small and thin as absolutely necessary to get that side to move. I agree a thin hand saw would be best for this.

However, I would also not discount the idea of steaming a piece to see how pliable it becomes. You can make a simple steamer with a piece of pipe a bit longer than your piece of wood, positioned at about a 5-10 degree angle coming up from a pot of boing water. Cap the end that is sticking up and make a small hole to release any pressure but assure the steam stays in long enough to get to the wood. Use alluminum foil to wrap the edge of the pot and the open end of the pipe over the pot. 30 minutes over that (edited: May take longer for teak) and I bet it will easily be bent around that curve. Make a jig to secure it to after it is steamed and let it cool down and dry on the jig. I would also try and find a creative way to clamp it while installing versus using screws and plugs. Will look nicer.

Here's a link to one a guy made that is pretty fancy but gives you the idea...
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= ... %26hl%3Den

Lots of other stuff on line if you search "homemade wood steamer". When I was in the Peace Corps we made one out of a scrap piece of 4" PVC and a big iron pot over an open fire. I had my doubts until we pulled the boards out and they were almost limp.

However you do it...wood good.
The world always seems brighter when you've just made something that wasn't there before - Neil Gaiman

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Re: Teak

Post by Murry » Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:41 am

Wow. 8O :D Where have I been on this one? :lol:

Thank you guys so much for helping out on this one :!:

After reading both of your very informative posts. I'm now wondering if boiling the wood could work in this case because it's
such a small piece of wood. Do you think submergeing it would be a big deal?

If not, I guess I'll be making some sort of steamer. :D

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ks8
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Re: Teak

Post by ks8 » Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:57 pm

Even though I have no experience steaming teak (I've watched oak steamed and bent), a small steamer sounds like a plan, but have some excellent thick leather gloves to handle the *hot* steaming wood. Predrill the holes for the *bend it into place and hold it* screws in the part, and have large washers ready for those screws. On one side of the area on the hull where it will be attached, you can also predrill some properly undersized holes for the screws on that side and do a dry run of cranking in the screws to create threads, with that side of teak in place (but obviously not to try and bend it yet). You can't really predrill and *tap* the other side yet because you are not 100% sure where the steamed holes will fall over the mounting area, but you can establish the other side. Remember, your part needs to be a bit longer than the visual of the landing area, because of the curve.

When you have *pretapped* threads in a hole, a good way to do the final install of the screws is to run them down to where the threads begin, then back off slowly until you feel the screw *clunk* into the pretapped threads, and then tighten them down in the existing threads, else you may cut new threads and risk stripping the hole. You need as much strength as possible to clamp the steamed teak down to that curve.

I would be tempted to make a mockup of that curve, but slightly smaller radius, on some good solid scrap, as a mold, and shape the steamed wood on that instead of on the hull. The slightly tighter radius of the mockup would also help you build in a bit for any possible spring back. Once cooled, it is then an easy matter to remove it from the mold and screw into place on the hull, where you can then drill perfectly spaced holes by using the formed part as the template, getting the part centered much better, and even cutting down an overly long part to fit in perfectly. The scrap mold approach doesn't risk your nicely prepped hull at all. :)

We will, of course, need a few pictures, no matter which method you employ. :D

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Re: Teak

Post by Murry » Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:32 pm

Thanks for the repsonse ks8.

I'm planning to use a mold to bend the wood and not the boat and I'm going to make the radius of the mold slighty tighter. However, I'm trying to avoid using screws. I just want it bonded to the hull and seamlessly faired in.

So, submergeing the wood in a pot of boiling water would be problem :?:
Thanks

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FLYonWALL9
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Re: Teak

Post by FLYonWALL9 » Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:48 pm

Murry wrote:Thanks for the repsonse ks8.

I'm planning to use a mold to bend the wood and not the boat and I'm going to make the radius of the mold slighty tighter. However, I'm trying to avoid using screws.

So, submergeing the wood in a pot of boiling water would be problem :?:
Thanks

That being the case I would make both female and male molds to put your
part in the middle.

The thing with using water is not only the heat but the pressure the part
is under while its in the steam box.

imho, building a steam box and a set up to make the steam and all its
parts just to make one part on the boat is much more work than I would
do. Kerfs just seem the better choice, it also takes the what ifs and unknowns
out of the picture.

But like KS said pictures of the process will be a must :wink:

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Re: Teak

Post by ks8 » Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:39 pm

Yep... as Scott said...

For a few curved laminates, I cut the curve (slightly tighter) is a 2x4 or 2x6, made the laminates 2 inches longer on each end, and the 2x4 mold), slapped epoxy on the laminates and clamped them to the bottom mold (with plastic wrap over the mold surface of course :lol: ). Then, with plastic wrap over the upper *mold* also, I clamped theat to the other mess and had the curved laminate clamped between the two *molds*. Worked very well, though it needed a bit of cleanup of the oozings. I'm thinking it may work just as well for a steamed piece, with much less mess. :D

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Re: Teak

Post by Murry » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:18 pm

Since I'm planning to leave it natural(as oiled only). I'm worried about the glue lines being visible at all the cuts to kerf it.
:doh:

I think I'll see what it does dry before trying to steam it.

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Re: Teak

Post by Cracker Larry » Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:11 pm

The kerf lines would certainly show in natural teak. I would think you could steam that piece in a big pot with a basket and an inch or 2 of water.

I might be inclined to saw the curve instead of bending it. Do you have enough wood to laminate it in a way that you could match the curve with a saw cut?
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