FS17 Build Planning

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Ak99999
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FS17 Build Planning

Post by Ak99999 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

Good Evening all, I am a new member and starting on my journey of building my first boat. Currently, I have no boating knowledge other than what google has told me (right, wrong, or indifferent). My wife told me, I couldn't buy a boat, but she never said anything about building one. She knows I am building one and she is fine with it.

I have a few questions regarding my build, but before I get there let me tell you about my intended uses. I live in Seattle, WA and my intention is to primarily cruise around Lake Washington with the family or friends (4 adults). I would like to occasionally fish as well in Lake Washington (probably only with 2 or 3 adults). Eventually, I would consider venturing into the Puget Sound, but I worry about the salt and the maintenance nightmare it creates.

The build I am considering building is the Fast Skiff 17. The 17 foot is based on the space I have available to store the boat.

1) Is the FS17 the right build for my novice level? I already have woodworking experience, but no fiberglass experience. I am considering the CNC kit since the costs of this option versus acquiring all the plywood (and factoring waste) here is close.

2) I am curious about deck layout. I like the idea of the center console with the seat in the front, and a bench behind the console. Could I widen the console to sit two people? I would probably make the bench to accommodate two as well. Are there any other recommendations for a layout to accommodate four?

3) For all the "hardware" pieces like cleats, ubolts, lights, anything that screws/bolts into the hull, do I do this before I fiberglass and paint? or do I just screw it in after everything is done?

4) Gas storage. I plan on using a portable tank I can remove when I want to fill it up. What I have been able to find is that its ideal to put the gas tank under the console, is it as simple as making a spot for it under the console and strapping it down?

5) Wiring chases and other pipes. So I have been looking at other builds on the forum, I noticed there is a lot of piping people add to their builds. I understand I will need separate chases for fuel and electrical. Are the other ones for water or something else?

6) So as part of my build I would like to have a hatch at the bow for storage, do I need to worry about water collection? Is this what I would use the piping for (see question 4), which is at the bottom of the transom and uses the drain plug?

7) For water accumulation on the sole, is this just suppose to drain via the pipe at the rear of the boat, through the transom?

8) Do I need to worry about water accumulation anywhere else? Like under the sole? My plan is to put as much buoyancy foam as I can under the sole.

9) For the console, can I build this with non marine plywood, specifically baltic birch. I have a bunch of this on hand.

Thank you all for your responses. Let me know if I am missing anything here, I am a newbie here.



narfi
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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by narfi » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:32 am

Welcome to the fun :)
I am currently building a fs17 and built a canoe as a learning project. I had zero woodworking experience and almost no fiberglass experience before starting. The beauty of the system of boat building here is it is very forgiving and easy to fix mistakes while making a very nice looking, sturdy and seaworthy vessel. Everything I know I have learned from this forum.

You can check out my build threads in my signature.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am


The build I am considering building is the Fast Skiff 17. The 17 foot is based on the space I have available to store the boat.

1) Is the FS17 the right build for my novice level? I already have woodworking experience, but no fiberglass experience. I am considering the CNC kit since the costs of this option versus acquiring all the plywood (and factoring waste) here is close.
I think if you like the look and size it is a great choice, you can customize it however you like.
I hear the cnc kits are nice, but honestly the marking and cutting out panels is pretty simple even for a beginner.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am
2) I am curious about deck layout. I like the idea of the center console with the seat in the front, and a bench behind the console. Could I widen the console to sit two people? I would probably make the bench to accommodate two as well. Are there any other recommendations for a layout to accommodate four?
Lots of people like center consoles, you can find some good examples on the forum here.
I will have seating for 4+ with two side consoles you can see in my build thread.
You can customize the layout however you want as long as you roughly keep the center of gravity the same. I say roughly because I was overly obsessed with balance and the designer said it's not that big of a deal as long as its close.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

3) For all the "hardware" pieces like cleats, ubolts, lights, anything that screws/bolts into the hull, do I do this before I fiberglass and paint? or do I just screw it in after everything is done?
The plans explain how to put reinforcing backing plates for any hardware. All holes drilled in the would should be drilled larger than needed, then filled with epoxy and then drilled again. This prevents water from ever reaching the wood and damaging it. I plan to fit everything before painting, then removing it all, painting and then final install once the paint is cured.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

4) Gas storage. I plan on using a portable tank I can remove when I want to fill it up. What I have been able to find is that its ideal to put the gas tank under the console, is it as simple as making a spot for it under the console and strapping it down?
Yes, that should work fine.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am
5) Wiring chases and other pipes. So I have been looking at other builds on the forum, I noticed there is a lot of piping people add to their builds. I understand I will need separate chases for fuel and electrical. Are the other ones for water or something else?
Gas, throttle cables, control harness, wiring, steering, etc...

Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

6) So as part of my build I would like to have a hatch at the bow for storage, do I need to worry about water collection? Is this what I would use the piping for (see question 4), which is at the bottom of the transom and uses the drain plug?
The boat is designed to be self bailing, IF you have the floor/sole completely sealed. I have the bow compartment drain back to the main deck and then out the sides(you van can drain out the back of the transom)
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

7) For water accumulation on the sole, is this just suppose to drain via the pipe at the rear of the boat, through the transom?
Yes
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am
8) Do I need to worry about water accumulation anywhere else? Like under the sole? My plan is to put as much buoyancy foam as I can under the sole.
If properly sealed, you should not get any water under the sole.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

9) For the console, can I build this with non marine plywood, specifically baltic birch. I have a bunch of this on hand.
Yes
You can build all of the boat with any wood you want, its yours.... the two main concerns are weight and waterproof glue in the plywood with rot resistant species and pliability also taken into consideration. For the main hull it's best to go with high quality marine, some people do use other stuff for their consoles.
I chose to use all marine plywood because I dont know enough to choose where it is ok and not. And also the cost of the plywood isnt that much in the big scheme of the project.
Ak99999 wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:21 am

Thank you all for your responses. Let me know if I am missing anything here, I am a newbie here.
There is the build budget you tell your wife,
The cost of the plywood and the epoxy and the plans.

There is the build budget you tell yourself,
What you told your wife plus the motor and some hardware.

Then there is your real build budget,
What you told yourself + alot more hardware, wiring, plumbing, new tools along the way, lots of consumables, more epoxy when you run out from using too much, paint and primer, electronics and instruments, and all the little bits and peices you never thought of.

It is a very rewarding hobby, I hope you enjoy it as much as I have.

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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by Capt UB » Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:57 am

Welcome to the the forum.

You have picked a good boat to build, but just wandering if a larger one would be better in your area. I say this because of the weather there.

Where will you be building her, outside, carport or inside?

There are a lot of tricks and help from other types of builds, check them out. This is another source of information here.

http://bateau2.com/howto-index.php

All of these builds have same thing in common, us.... Ask any and all questions..... Use the search to help find things...

Good luck and have fun......
Bob
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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by Jeff » Mon Jun 03, 2019 8:00 am

Ak99999, welcome to our Builders Forum!! I am confident you will enjoy the conversations, excellent guidance and help here!! Again, welcome, Jeff

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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by joe2700 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:28 am

Capt UB wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:57 am
Welcome to the the forum.

You have picked a good boat to build, but just wandering if a larger one would be better in your area. I say this because of the weather there.
Another option is the raised sheer which is in the plans. I'm building that option but haven't finished the boat yet. It will give you more protection form waves in my opinion, but I do think the designer is not so convinced. I'll answer some of OPs other questions but again my build is still in progress.
1) Is the FS17 the right build for my novice level? I already have woodworking experience, but no fiberglass experience. I am considering the CNC kit since the costs of this option versus acquiring all the plywood (and factoring waste) here is close.
I think an FS17 is definitely buildable by a novice(you won't be by the end). That said if I were you I would do a small fiberglass project first. You will make a few mistakes and it will be cheaper and quicker to make them on either a really small boat or just some test pieces. I'm sure you could get away without doing that though, the key is to be methodical in your measuring and mixing.
2) I am curious about deck layout. I like the idea of the center console with the seat in the front, and a bench behind the console. Could I widen the console to sit two people? I would probably make the bench to accommodate two as well. Are there any other recommendations for a layout to accommodate four?
The bench can definitely be wide enough to fit 2. The front of the console could, but is often a more narrow at the front because the boat starts to get narrow there and you need room to walk around it. The other options are a back facing bench at the forward frame A(doubles as a step to the bow deck.)

I find people want to stand if you are going fast anyway unless the water is perfectly flat, and if you are going slow sitting on the bow, side, or stern decks is fine. This also might be more comfortable with the raised sheer.
3) For all the "hardware" pieces like cleats, ubolts, lights, anything that screws/bolts into the hull, do I do this before I fiberglass and paint? or do I just screw it in after everything is done?
You install them afterwards, although between the main fiberglassing and paint you will want to figure out where they all go. This is so you can install backing plates on things that need to be strong like cleats and bow eyes. Also so you can drill all the mounting holes bigger than the screws, and fill them with thickened epoxy. This prevents water from getting at the plywood core when you drill the real hole.
5) Wiring chases and other pipes. So I have been looking at other builds on the forum, I noticed there is a lot of piping people add to their builds. I understand I will need separate chases for fuel and electrical. Are the other ones for water or something else?
Fuel, electric, throttle/steering cables, steering cable/hose. Things like the electric harness for the outboard might have a large plug that needs to make it though. You will find you need more bigger tubes than you think.
6) So as part of my build I would like to have a hatch at the bow for storage, do I need to worry about water collection? Is this what I would use the piping for (see question 4), which is at the bottom of the transom and uses the drain plug?
The anchor locker is usually allowed to drain overboard if the bottom is above the waterline, since it gets filled with water and dirt anyway. For other storage at the bow you would want to buy or build waterproof hatches. If the hatches you buy or build don't prove to be 100% waterproof you can allow the storage area to drain to the bilge to be pumped out, or drain to the sole if not below it. If you don't foam the middle under the sole water can just run down the middle though limber holes. If you foam it all you would need a pipe to allow water from a forward hatch drain to get to the stern.
7) For water accumulation on the sole, is this just suppose to drain via the pipe at the rear of the boat, through the transom?
Yes exactly. Some people(myself included) raise the sole from the plans to allow the boat to self drain even when loaded. Either way you want large but pluggable drains, if there is enough weight in the boat some water will come in the back.
8) Do I need to worry about water accumulation anywhere else? Like under the sole? My plan is to put as much buoyancy foam as I can under the sole.
Water will eventually get everywhere, so either trust foam to keep a compartment dry or make sure it drains somewhere. In my boat everything drains to under the motor well where there are bilge pumps, other than the anchor locker and above the sole draining directly overboard.

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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by silentneko » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:48 pm

I did extensive planning my some standards on my FS17, but it is my 4th build, so I wanted a few extra options. I chose it because like you I am limited on garage space. Here is a thread I had on balance and layout planning. Most don' do this, but I'm glad I did because everything has worked out well with the layout. I'm about 86% done with the build.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=61878
Built: 15ft Skiff, 16ft Skiff, Modified Cheap Canoe.....FS17 coming soon!

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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by TomW1 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:19 pm

One important point. Use electrical sweep elbows and not plumbing elbows on the ends of your chases. On sizes of chase tubes use 1 1/4 or 1 1/2 for your fuel line, 1 inch will have you greasing the wire to pull it through the chase. At least a 2" for your steering and controls. Electrical a separate chase for your fish finder and another for all other electrical items, maybe a 1 1/2 or 2 inch depending on what fittings are on them. Electrical wiring cannot go into mechanical chase tubes. Then a chase tube forward for your bow lights and depending if you run you have a trolling motor chaste tube from battery to switch. Then add an extra 1 1/2 chase to the back in case you want to add anything later

Tom
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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by Capt UB » Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:57 pm

Thin walled PVC pipe.... The outside dia. is the same as sec 40 and the inside dia. is bigger. Only problem, all the fittings are the same inside dia. as sec 40...

Like Tom said use the big angle, but use the straight thin walled PVC pipe. You don't want the wires or fuel line tight inside.
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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by BB Sig » Mon Jun 03, 2019 9:39 pm

I've had good luck with a heat gun to custom bend my pvc pipes. Less joints makes easier pulls.

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Re: FS17 Build Planning

Post by Ak99999 » Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:44 am

Capt UB wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:57 am
Where will you be building her, outside, carport or inside?
I will be building in the garage. It will be a tight squeeze, but I will make it work.

Thank you all for the responses, so obviously this created much more questions. Let me just clarify my vision: This boat should be safe and functional.So with that in mind here are the electronics I want to include: nav lights, fish finder/gps, marine radio. Nothing fancier then that.

From a control standpoint, what am I looking for? I understand there is a throttle and a steering wheel, but that is it. What else is there to it from a technical/mechanical standpoint? Is this just a bunch of cables or is it hydraulic? Can anyone give some recommendations on this section?

What is needed to make the steering, control, and electronics all work?

To clarify the drainage standpoint, do the drains at the transom get plugged? is it far enough above the waterline that i don't have to worry about it?

Thanks again!

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