Fixed.......... Found water under the cockpit deck

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Capt UB
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Fixed.......... Found water under the cockpit deck

Post by Capt UB » Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:20 am

FS14

I used 2 part foam under the cockpit floor. Looked good after I leveled the foam, coated with epoxy about a week later. Then glued down cockpit deck (sole), it was coated with epoxy both sides. The deck was taped on the seams and a neat coat of epoxy put down. That was 2 years ago?

Today, I was sanding inside one of the aft compartments to add a cleat, I found water in the back corner. Found it was coming from between the stringer and aft bulkhead/frame. A few weeks ago, I did find water in all 3 of the aft compartments. I just thought it was rain water that got through the tarp into the open hatches.

So I used a hole saw to make a hole just forward of the bulkhead/frame, close to the stringer (between stringer and hull). What I found was water and shrunk foam. It was the same on the other side!

I did not drill any limber holes or any other holes in the frames under the cockpit deck (between the hull and stringer), I did drill holes for the chase pipes between the stringers.

I need to check the other (sealed) compartments under the cockpit deck.... Total of 15!!

The shrunk foam does not bother me, I like using the pool noodles anyway.

Should I just drill 1" holes and wet/vac water out or cut open a larger area over each compartment?

The cockpit deck is/was getting cleaned up for paint and Kiwi Grip, so no problems with fixing any holes.

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Last edited by Capt UB on Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:33 pm, edited 3 times in total.


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fallguy1000
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Re: 2 part foam failed..... But wait!!; Found water too!!!!

Post by fallguy1000 » Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:36 am

Inch holes are pretty small..

I'd go a bit bigger, like 4".

But how did the water find its way? That is the bigger ?
My boat build is here -------->

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Re: 2 part foam failed..... But wait!!; Found water too!!!!

Post by jacquesmm » Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:32 am

fallguy1000 wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:36 am
But how did the water find its way? That is the bigger ?
That is the important question. With a sole tabbed all around, there is no reason for water to get in there. We must be overlooking something.
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Capt UB
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Found water under the cockpit deck

Post by Capt UB » Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:52 pm

I'm going to careful cut just the ply on either side of the stringers (between hull and stringer) from aft frame to front frame, about 4" before the frames, then across. This will allow me access to all 15 compartments.

That will allow me to add limber holes (if needed) and remove water from compartments if any is there. This for me will be the quickest and easies.

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Last edited by Capt UB on Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Found water under the cockpit deck

Post by Capt UB » Sat Jun 20, 2020 6:20 pm

Cutting out the deck...

foam has shrunk here to!

Compartments so far have water in them...

Not sure yet how water gets into compartments...
Maybe one or two, but all????
Stringer has no holes on it and frames, none between them...
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Just the first part of cutting deck... You can see the water and foam.
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Last edited by Capt UB on Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2 part foam failed..... But wait!!; Found water too!!!!

Post by Dan_Smullen » Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:17 pm

Are you seeing any wet spots or bubbling paint on the bottom around seams? Chine and keel?

Did you use fasteners to secure the sole to frames and stringers? Permanent or temporary?

I’m really interested and n learning how it’s gett in there.

Is the water salty or fresh?

How many times on the water?

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Re: 2 part foam failed..... But wait!!; Found water too!!!!

Post by OneWayTraffic » Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:33 am

My guess is in through where the chase tubes penetrate the hull. PVC doesn't really bond. I'm pretty much decided to have no foam below the DWL except some extruded polystyrene. Lots of compartments and inspection ports.

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Found water under the cockpit deck

Post by Capt UB » Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:22 am

No leaks from outside of hull. The water is moving between compartments under the cockpit deck. The chase tubes could be it! But I have used 5200 on PVC pipe for years without problems, the tubes were ruffed up!

Here is what I'm thinking..... The tarp let in a lot of water a few months ago. The water filled the aft and forward compartments, I had the hatches open (tarp was over the opening). Now that may have just added more water to what was in there..... I am seeing some small gap's between the ribs and stringers (all had cleats) from the decking, this would allow water to move around under the the deck.

The water is rain water, not salt or river water. I looked at it with a microscope....

I will be cutting out more later today. Too early to use power tools in my neighborhood.....

I am going to remove the foam.... Yes I'm going with pool noodles!!!!!

I have fished all over the Central East Coast Florida, all over Mosquito Lagoon and from the head waters of the St. Johns river to Palatka north. Camped, explored lot's of lakes and creaks in my FS14 SandPiper...

With the LM18 build gone, Sandpiper will stay in the carport for now. I will seal, close and put on a better cover when stored outside, later.

SandPiper is such a great handing and safe boat. She is worth any and all I can do!

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Last edited by Capt UB on Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Found water under the cockpit deck

Post by Capt UB » Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:24 pm

All 15 compartment's foam shrunk on 4 sides and the top (pulled away from the hull, frames and stringers. The top in some areas 2". Water was/is between the foam and boat. I now have to take out all the foam. More plywood has to be removed too.
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Last edited by Capt UB on Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2 part foam failed..... But wait!!; Found water too!!!!

Post by silentneko » Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:43 pm

Sorry to see this. It sucks having to redo thinks you thought were solid. A few observations.

There was a discussion on my build about chases if I recall. I don't foam chase tubes, they will always leak in my experience and there is no way to remedy them easily. I foam the outside compartments that will be totally sealed, but leave the middle dedicated for water flow and chases.

Neat coating plywood doesn't work long term for anything but a small cleat. I don't care who says otherwise, I've had both meranti and okoume check on me with just a few neat coats.. If you are in a place like Florida the heat will swell and expand any ply enough to cause checking. For a piece as big as the sole a light cloth is really needed on both sides. Enough checking can lead to moisture creep and rot issues later on.

When bedding the sole you really need 2 guys to make sure it goes down flat on the bedding compound. And the compound needs to be liberally applied to all surfaces in a wide and tall ribbon. Any open spaces will let moisture into places it shouldn't be and it will accumulate over time.

That circles around to the tarp. A boat should never be under a plastic tarp as moisture will accumulate and will stay. A decent boat cover has vents on top to allow heat and moisture out. Even the cheapo boat covers can lead to issues if left on long enough.

As far as the foam goes, how long was it between pouring the foam and attaching the deck. I had a bit of trouble with the foam from here. It shrank like your pictures. I ended up doing a few supplemental pours to fix it and let it set up for a week before the floor section went on. Not sure why it happened, but it didn't with the previous batch I got.

Good luck fixing her up.
Built: 15ft Skiff, 16ft Skiff, Modified Cheap Canoe.....FS17 coming soon!

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