Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

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Christer
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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by Christer » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:02 pm

TomW1 wrote:
Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:48 pm
Christer have you looked hard at the CS25 it gives you a much larger rear deck with the bracket. It gives you the toilet space and a place to lie down or sit and shoot the bs. I say lie down cause if they get sea sick the last thing they want to do is be standing up. :lol: It also places you higher for spotting birds which indicates schools of fish, at least over here they do. It also has a refrigerator, stove, storage drawers and sink which you may not want but you can leave out and replace with a large cooler. Just food for thought.

Good to see another Norwegian builder with us.

Tom
Tom, thanks for your comments.

As I wrote in my previous post, I've decided to stick with the standard, unscaled version, though with a different front deck/cabin. It'll likely be a variant of the CX25 more than a variant of the CS25, but then again, they are more or less the same boat.

I'll absolutely build the bracket version; getting the engine(s) as far from people as possible is always a Good Thing(tm).

I have already identified my carport as (way) too small for building the boat in there, so I need to work something out somehow. Also, storage during winter may or may not be a challenge, but I'll deal with such minor insignificancies later on. :)


8ft dinghy built in 1992, BBV sufferer ever since.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by cracked_ribs » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:02 am

Christer wrote:
Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:57 pm
the picture I shamelessly stole
Oh, consider that open source. I'd love to see someone take a whack at that concept. My own plans got interrupted and I'm stuck in an apartment where I can't build a dinghy, let alone a 25 foot boat.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by Christer » Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:15 pm

After much pondering and also a boat trip this weekend, I've decided that I need a boat with a pilothouse that is completely closed to get out of the elements.

We (the dragon and I) want (and need) a boat that can be used all year round, and as the weather here on the west coast of Norway is unpredictable at best - a nice, sunny (but not necessarily warm) day can turn to a rainy, stormy day in the blink of an eye, the ability to get out of the weather is an absolute requirement.

We were overtaken by a nice looking boat while out, later identified as an Axopar 28 with a 400HP Mercury outboard at the back. Looks like this:

Image

I liked the boat a lot, but I like the lines of the CS better, and I would love to have a pilothouse on a CS/CX hull with seating for 6 people, a front deck with berths, a fridge and a head in the bow. I'm just not sure how that will look. Maybe I'll need to abandon the CS hull altogether, even though I think it would be a great hull for whatever the North Sea has to offer.

I'll try to place a pilothouse on a 28-30-ish ft CS/CX hull with a 9ft beam but I'm not sure anyone will like the outcome.

This is perhaps also venturing a ways off scope from "just" a stretched CS/CX25 hull...
8ft dinghy built in 1992, BBV sufferer ever since.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by peter-curacao » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:05 pm

That boat looks more like a Gulfstream 28 therefore I also think that cabin also looks better on the GS, my personal opinion is that a cabin like that doesn't fit the CS sheerline to well, but that's me. dimensions between that boat and the Gulfstream argent that different though 10 cm in length end 30 cm in beam, Maybe if you build the cabin off center against either one gunnel,I think you can even fit more or less the same size with the berth.
Edit:You see how narrow those paths are in the picture? this would be 15 cm smaller if you place it in the center that's why my remark to place it of center , but now I think of it I don't know what that would do with the balance of the boat
Image
Image

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by Jaysen » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:24 pm

peter-curacao wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:05 pm
Edit:You see how narrow those paths are in the picture? this would be 15 cm smaller if you place it in the center that's why my remark to place it of center , but now I think of it I don't know what that would do with the balance of the boat
Baffled water ballast tanks to compensate? Offset fuel tanks?

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by peter-curacao » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:38 pm

Jaysen wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:24 pm
peter-curacao wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:05 pm
Edit:You see how narrow those paths are in the picture? this would be 15 cm smaller if you place it in the center that's why my remark to place it of center , but now I think of it I don't know what that would do with the balance of the boat
Baffled water ballast tanks to compensate? Offset fuel tanks?
Yes I was thinking that but those are variable so I don't know if that can count as compensation.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by peter-curacao » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:40 pm

Here you have the 2 married together :D 8)
Image
Last edited by peter-curacao on Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by Jaysen » Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:03 pm

peter-curacao wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:38 pm
Jaysen wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:24 pm
peter-curacao wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:05 pm
Edit:You see how narrow those paths are in the picture? this would be 15 cm smaller if you place it in the center that's why my remark to place it of center , but now I think of it I don't know what that would do with the balance of the boat
Baffled water ballast tanks to compensate? Offset fuel tanks?
Yes I was thinking that but those are variable so I don't know if that can count as compensation.
If you paired fuel and water ballast you could add water as fuel was consumed. Or even just use lead/concrete to balance the hull. That would be simple. Less "sexy" but likely smarter.

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by peter-curacao » Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:06 pm

Jaysen wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:03 pm

Or even just use lead/concrete to balance the hull. That would be simple. Less "sexy" but likely smarter.
Yeah and when build in foam I doesn't have to be much I think

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Re: Yet another "scaled CS25?" thread

Post by Christer » Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:33 pm

peter-curacao wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:05 pm
That boat looks more like a Gulfstream 28 therefore I also think that cabin also looks better on the GS, my personal opinion is that a cabin like that doesn't fit the CS sheerline to well, but that's me. dimensions between that boat and the Gulfstream argent that different though 10 cm in length end 30 cm in beam, Maybe if you build the cabin off center against either one gunnel,I think you can even fit more or less the same size with the berth.
Edit:You see how narrow those paths are in the picture? this would be 15 cm smaller if you place it in the center that's why my remark to place it of center , but now I think of it I don't know what that would do with the balance of the boat
Image
Image
I don't think the hulls are that similar, to be honest, plus I want the higher freeboard of the CS hull. The walkaround paths will be very narrow if the pilothouse is to seat 6 people, so I made a mockup where the pilothouse is joined by the front deck (think jump cabin version of the CS25) as well as the gunwales on both sides. To access the front deck you'd have to step on the gunwales.

Here's my attempt, and honestly I don't think it looks all that bad. Not too good either, but I've seen far worse pilothouses on sexy hulls.

The hull has been stretched to 30 ft without regard to anything that has anything to do with seaworthiness, strength, or any of the boat design technical stuff, simply because those are things I know nothing about (yet). The beam has been increased to just shy of 10 ft, so basically it's a CS/CX25 upscaled 17%. There's also a bracket at the stern, which has been upscaled as well as it was already in the picture; that will obviously not be scaled/larger if built. I've called my creation CX30 Pilothouse (CX30PH). Behold:

1643

The front deck will have a hatch for light and emergency escape. Below the front deck there will be a berth for two people and a head, and possibly some cabinets, a fridge, cooktop or something, depending on what the boat will be used for.

There are limits to what I can do with low-res pictures, but the side doors will naturally be removed, and there will be a rear door (from the cockpit) into the pilothouse.

The seating will obviously need to be rearranged a bit from what's shown in the picture. The helm will have the necessary gadgetry for driving the boat, and a single seat for the skipper. On the opposite side there will be a 2-seat bench, and between the seats a doorway and stairs down to the cabin/berths/head.

Rear seating will be 2+1 in the middle row and a single seat at the rear behind the skipper, and a sliding door and exit to the cockpit beside that seat. I'm not sure if that seat will at all be there or if there should just be standing room instead. It may be a bit cramped with three rows of seats.

If the width of the PH is insufficient, the seating arrangement will be 1+1 seats in 3 rows, with a passageway in the middle.

I haven't thought too much about the dimensions of the PH, but standing headroom needs to be 200cm (about 6'7") as I'm 193cm (6'4") tall and really don't like banging my head into things. I realize this may be a problem because of the sole, but since the pilothouse is so far forward and there are extra weight in the bow (berths, head, etc), the fuel tanks could possibly be placed side-by-side below the cockpit sole, with the freshwater and waste water tanks placed further forward as they are (will be) smaller. The cockpit sole may need to be raised slightly to accommodate the fuel tanks, but the amount it is raised, and thus the freeboard lost, can be regained by placing rails along the length of the gunwales surrounding the cockpit. Not pictured are folding seats/benches in the cockpit for those 15 minutes of summer we usually get in western Norway. :)

The transom will have two or three storage compartments, as I have never fished using live bait and probably never will, so I don't need livewells. Those compartments will instead be holding various things like rope, temporary mooring bolts, tools, etc.

I would also love to have a door to enter the cockpit, one on each side, but I fear that will compromise the hull's strength dramatically.

Thoughts?
Last edited by Christer on Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
8ft dinghy built in 1992, BBV sufferer ever since.

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